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 Post subject: Can you help me find Mr. Simmonds?
 Post Posted: Sun May 28, 2017 12:23 am 
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Where was he born? What was his livelihood? Where and when did he die? Did he have any children with Lucy?

I discovered a researcher's note in Twillingate Congregational Church Parish Records: Marriages 1877-1902 which displays the marriage record of my great-grandfather: 26 Aug 1889 George Payne, 26 bachelor fisherman, married Lilla Rideout, 24 spinster, both residents of Twillingate. George's father was Charles Payne; Lilla's father was Philip Rideout; the officiant was John F Geddes. And then, this research note: "George was the s/o Charles & Martha Payne. & likely grandson of George Payne. He md (2) widow Lucy A. Simmonds. Lilla was b Jan 10 1866 Wild Cove d Aug 216 1901 Wild Cove age 36 yrs; her mother was Jane Fox."

Subsequently, I found in Civil Registration of Multidenominational Marriages in Notre Dame Bay, Nfld., Part 3 (1901-1908) this marriage record: 19 Apr 1902 in Twillingate, George Payne 45 widower fisherman Methodist of Wild Cove married Lucy A Simmonds 40 widow Methodist of Wild Cove. James Janes and Minnie Roberts were witnesses. George's age may not be accurate there. No information about who Lucy had been widowed by.

My mother and her two sisters (all still living) remember Lucy as the only "Nanny" they ever knew. She married their grandfather George in 1902 when he had been left with six children all under the age of 10 when his first wife passed away in 1901. My grandfather was not yet two. No one knew anything of the fact that Lucy had been married before she married their grandfather.

In 1942 while living in Toronto, perhaps realizing there was no record of her birth, Lucy Ann Janes, now the wife of George Payne, filed an Application for Registration of Birth to the Registrar General of St. John's Newfoundland claiming she was born 6 Nov 1861 in Twillingate, Nfld. with supporting affidavit sworn by James John Janes in support of the application as "an older brother of Lucy Ann Janes and was present at her birth".

(Similarly, at the same time, George Payne applied for registration of his birth in Twillingate 2 Aug 1864 with supporting affidavit sworn by an Andrew Roberts)

My mother and her sisters all remember Lucy as being from the Janes family of Twillingate. A source Citation for Ontario, Canada, Deaths, 1869-1938, 1943-1944, and Deaths Overseas, 1939-1947 provides a view of Lucy's Death Certificate with the following additional information: Born Newfoundland 6 Nov 1861. Died 23 Nov 1944 in Toronto, buried Prospect Cemetery, age 83. Married to George Payne, daughter of George Janes and Ann Blake, all from Newfoundland.

Lucy Ann Janes became Lucy A. Simmonds, was widowed, and then became Lucy Ann Payne ... all without anyone knowing who Mr Simmonds may have been!

Can anyone (particularly the researcher who included that note in the record of George Payne's first marriage) help?

Ed
Ontario

P.S.
My best guess so far (Vital Records, Register of Deaths, Book 3, Bonnavista Bay District 1899-1902, P.238) 5 Mar 1900 at Cannings Cove, William Simmonds, age 35 of consumption, born Cannings Cove, buried Cannings Cove, Church of England ... but, I can't actually connect him!


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 Post subject: Re: Can you help me find Mr. Simmonds?
 Post Posted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 6:37 am 
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Hi Ed,

I can empathize with you -- the Simmonds/Simmons family are tough!

The problem with the William Simmonds below that you have identified in Cannings Cove is that is Bonavista District, not Twillingate.

This may not help but following is the Twillingate Simmons/Simmonds 1889 Voters List -- it is pretty short (only 4 men) and 2 of them are of my line and I know they weren't married to Lucy -- they are Willis and Hubert. The Henry shown here is born 1837, died 1935 (that's a ripe old age!) so he would not be a candidate. William is not a candidate for your Lucy, he lived until 1913 -- I'll outline him below.

Here's the list:

Box 5 Voters Lists 1889 (sourced at PANL)
District of Twillingate
Simmons
Name-Abode-Qualification
Henry, French Beach, householder
William, Starve Hr, Householder
Hubert, Harry’s Hr, 25 years
Willis, Harry’s Hr, Householder

Voters Lists are not the perfect resource but they are helpful. Thing is, if a man didn't qualify (i.e. If they were young/not of means, receiving poor aid, or were sick) they wouldn't be on the list.

Looking at the Twillingate Simmonds men in 1894 McAlpines -- two men, William and Stephen, both in Starve Harbour. So, William is the elder (Stephen's father, 1838-1913) in the list above and Stephen was too young to qualify to vote in 1889. Stephen lived 1870-1945 and was not married to Lucy. Confirming all this, the 1904 McAlpines directory show William and Stephen both at Gut Arm, near Starve Harbour.

In 1894, Henry is still in French Beach. In Harry's Harbour, my Hubert and Willis are there, now their younger brother John Eliezer is there as well -- plus a Frederick. However, then looking at 1904 Harry's Harbour and my gang there -- Hubert, Willis and John Eliezer are still there -- but not Frederick. He is not one of this line; he could be who you're looking for. He seems to be the only "Simmons gap" in the period.

Sorry, but not very conclusive. The records are just so brutal.

If you'd like to review further, shoot me your email address and I will respond. I do a fair bit of Simmons research and know of most of the cast.

Regards,
Carol


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 Post subject: Re: Can you help me find Mr. Simmonds?
 Post Posted: Tue Jun 20, 2017 4:09 am 
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Thank you, Carol, for your response. It is indeed hard to fill this 'Simmonds' gap in my Family tree. I knew Bonavista was not in Twillingate district, but I also considered the possibility that Lucy may not have remained in Twillingate once she reached adulthood. A wild imagination can come up with any number of reasons for that; but the scarcity of records leaves that open. For awhile, I was believing she'd moved to the USA ... Rhode Is. area, but later census records ruled that out. Among other possibilities I haven't ruled out yet is the discovery, in Might's Directory of St. John's for the year 1890, of a Lucy Janes living in a Salvation Army barracks house and apparently training as a cadet. Coincidentally, that directory also showed a William (I think!) Simmonds, a cabman living in the same general area. No indication that Lucy and William ever connected. In fact later directories showed that Simmonds gentleman was still there, but Lucy was gone. If she was in fact training to be a Salvation Army officer, that organization may have sent her 'who-knows-where' to do their work. Could that 'who-knows-where' have included places like Cannings Cove? Quite the puzzle! I appreciate any tid-bits of information. The search itself, while frustrating, is quite addictive!
Ed


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 Post subject: Re: Can you help me find Mr. Simmonds?
 Post Posted: Tue Jun 20, 2017 10:40 am 
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Hi Ed, yes the options are quite extensive and fun to research -- and you're right, it is quite addictive! If you ever figure out the elusive Lucy's marriage please post it here and I will add it to my database (of about 1000 Simmons folks) and if I encounter them along the way I will do likewise.


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 Post subject: Re: Can you help me find Mr. Simmonds?
 Post Posted: Wed Jun 21, 2017 1:34 am 
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James Simmonds resided on the Twillingate North Island during the 1880s. He would be a candidate as the first husband of Lucy Ann Janes, daughter of George Janes and Ann Blake.

Charles Payne and Martha May were the parents of George Payne.


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 Post subject: Re: Can you help me find Mr. Simmonds?
 Post Posted: Wed Jun 21, 2017 3:59 am 
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Thanks, Milt. I agree that someone in the Twillingate area would be a more likely candidate as Lucy Janes first husband. Until now, I have not seen this James Simmonds on the North Island in the 1880's. Can you tell me if he appears on any of the lists in this ngb.chebucto site?
Ed


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 Post subject: Re: Can you help me find Mr. Simmonds?
 Post Posted: Wed Jun 21, 2017 1:23 pm 
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Ed, I have seen his name in more than one record for that period. For instance, he is included in the 1882 Voter's List, but not in the 1889 Voter's List.


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 Post subject: Re: Can you help me find Mr. Simmonds?
 Post Posted: Thu Jun 29, 2017 1:39 am 
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Hi Milt,

James is one I haven't seen in the VL or directories -- can you point me to where you found him? I can't seem to track down the 1882 VL, is it online somewhere? I have a "one-off" record for a James Simmons and wife Hannah that had a son William James Simmons in 1886, Horse Island, Twillingate....that's all I have been able to find him otherwise. Would appreciate knowing what records he appears in -- thanks!

Also, Ed -- on your earlier note, William the Cabman in St John's was married to Elizabeth Voisey, and lived 1846-1903. He would not be your guy unfortunately.


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 Post subject: Re: Can you help me find Mr. Simmonds?
 Post Posted: Mon Jul 03, 2017 7:34 pm 
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Hi Ed - just saw your posting a little while ago. I am the person who transcribed the marriages you quoted above, and added the research notes, but am sorry that I can't tell you who Mr Simmonds is either. Chances are that both Lucy's baptism and her marriage to Mr Simmonds were both lost in the fire that destroyed Twillingate Anglican records in the 1870s. I checked the Gert Crosbie CD of BMD in Nfld Newspapers which goes to 1890, but there was no marriage for Lucy under Janes, Jeans, Jeynes, Jaynes reported.
Jill Marshall (St. Johns).


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